Are sample libraries too expensive?

José Herring said:

So to get on my soapbox a bit, I really think we need to celebrate the choices we have and get what we can afford but not worry about the price of it all. The market is so crushed I'm more worried that it collapses and we end up having to hold on to dated libraries that aren't being upgrade or start to sample our own libraries again or worst of all fears, everything goes subscription.

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I suspect it's not being crushed at all. I don't have any visibility into sales numbers and revenue, but it seems like the industry is doing well to me. There are tons of competing products in the most popular categories, but I suspect that the fact they're still making new entries is a hint that it remains profitable. The fact that VSL can afford to make Duality suggests to me that there's a lot of demand for string libraries, even from companies who've already made lots of string libraries.

Although sample libraries aren't physical objects that need to be manufactured, there is a physical component to their development and one can draw a parallel with stuff that has been going down in price for years. Stuff like solar panels that now cost a tenth of what they cost not long ago. It's the effect of economies of scale. Making a mould that will be used to manufacture 10,000 parts means that the capital cost per manufactured part will be significantly lower than if the same mould was used to only make 500 parts. You can start selling solar panels at a lower cost because it cost you less to make them than it used to and you'd still make the same margin, or more.

So when you sell a library to 100 professionals 20 years ago and are now selling it to 10,000 pros and hobbyist, you'd clearly be able to sell it at a much lower price (the one that will attract 9,000 hobbyists) and make more money than you used to. Over the years you also have developed recording techniques, improved scripts, better technology overall to assist you creating that library in a much more cost efficient way than you would have at the beginning of the sampling world. You're not reinventing the wheel, you build on what you and others made in the past.

A company deciding to make solar panels now doesn't make them like they used to 30 years ago. They'll be on top of all the current research so they can develop better panels in half the time they used to. That's a lot of overheads you don't need to recoup anymore.

And those libraries that have been our for 10 years or so? A lot of them would be pure profit minus server cost and support cost (if they're still supported).

This doesn't answer whether or not sample libraries are too cheap or too expensive. It merely addresses why they're cheaper than they used to be. Comparison to the past aren't necessarily relevant. You can compare solar panels rated with the same capacity if they're sold for $300 by one manufacturer and for $500 by the other, but there's no point saying oh it cost $2,000 for half the capacity 10 years ago. These times are gone and don't matter anymore.

QuiteAlright said:

I suspect it's not being crushed at all. I don't have any visibility into sales numbers and revenue, but it seems like the industry is doing well to me.

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I can’t speak for other devs, but from my corner the industry is certainly not doing well. My general numbers are down about 70% compared to just two years ago, and running sales doesn’t work anymore. My first summer sale 4 years ago made 7000 dollars from a single product. This year it has (so far) brought in just 800 dollars from 6 products, so something’s definitely not like it used to be.

New products seems to be the only thing that sells, and a lot less than they used too. I suspect that’s also why Spitfire, OT and VSL keep pumping out new stuff. They’d go bankrupt if they didn’t.

Whether the current state of affairs is because I’m a small dev with a limited number of (let’s be honest, niche and quirky) products, and I have reached and saturated my potential market, or it’s the economy (or a combination of both), I don’t yet know. Spitfires change in sales tactics and the fact that OT are now having regular sales, suggest to me that they are struggling too.

thesteelydane said:

I can’t speak for other devs, but from my corner the industry is certainly not doing well. My general numbers are down about 70% compared to just two years ago, and running sales doesn’t work anymore. My first summer sale 4 years ago made 7000 dollars from a single product. This year it has (so far) brought in just 800 dollars from 6 products, so something’s definitely not like it used to be.

New products seems to be the only thing that sells, and a lot less than they used too. I suspect that’s also why Spitfire, OT and VSL keep pumping out new stuff. They’d go bankrupt if they didn’t.

Whether the current state of affairs is because I’m a small dev with a limited number of (let’s be honest, niche and quirky) products, and I have reached and saturated my potential market, or it’s the economy (or a combination of both), I don’t yet know. Spitfires change in sales tactics and the fact that OT are now having regular sales, suggest to me that they are struggling too.

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Sorry to hear that. You make really great stuff that's very useful for sound design or just as is. I was hoping that these kind of niche libraries would find a new level of success now that the majors have flooded us with more traditional libraries. But sadly not I guess.

thesteelydane said:

I can’t speak for other devs, but from my corner the industry is certainly not doing well. My general numbers are down about 70% compared to just two years ago, and running sales doesn’t work anymore. My first summer sale 4 years ago made 7000 dollars from a single product. This year it has (so far) brought in just 800 dollars from 6 products, so something’s definitely not like it used to be.

New products seems to be the only thing that sells, and a lot less than they used too. I suspect that’s also why Spitfire, OT and VSL keep pumping out new stuff. They’d go bankrupt if they didn’t.

Whether the current state of affairs is because I’m a small dev with a limited number of (let’s be honest, niche and quirky) products, and I have reached and saturated my potential market, or it’s the economy (or a combination of both), I don’t yet know. Spitfires change in sales tactics and the fact that OT are now having regular sales, suggest to me that they are struggling too.

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It’s a double edged sword I love what you’ve released and bought most if not all of your releases but you don’t release new content very often. I was thrilled when you put out Bunker Percussion last month and bought it without hesitation ,it was the 1st new Bunker product that I didn’t already have in a really long time.

kgdrum said:

It’s a double edged sword I love what you’ve released and bought most if not all of your releases but you don’t release new content very often. I was thrilled when you put out Bunker Percussion last month and bought it without hesitation ,it was the 1st new Bunker product that I didn’t already have in a really long time.

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Bunker Percussion? Maybe the marketing is out because I've never heard of it. Where's the 1000 page thread on this one?

José Herring said:

Bunker Percussion? Maybe the marketing is out because I've never heard of it. Where's the 1000 page thread on this one?

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Sadly it's 3 pages.

José Herring said:

Bunker Percussion? Maybe the marketing is out because I've never heard of it. Where's the 1000 page thread on this one?

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I’ve tried, spent a bunch on banners here etc…but so far it has only brought in $4000 in revenue. Now, it IS a niche library, I know that, but that’s the kind of stuff that’s fun to make, but that’s obviously not sustainable from a business point of view to keep making weird stuff. A couple of years ago it would probably have brought in 3-4 times that, which would make it worth it.

kgdrum said:

but you don’t release new content very often.

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True. Many reasons, but still being a 100% one man operation is the main one. That said, there will be at least 3 releases this year, which is a big step up

thesteelydane said:

True. Many reasons, but still being a 100% one man operation is the main one. That said, there will be at least 3 releases this year, which is a big step up

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Good News!
FWIW this means you can probably expect 3 purchases from moi.

thesteelydane said:

I can’t speak for other devs, but from my corner the industry is certainly not doing well. My general numbers are down about 70% compared to just two years ago, and running sales doesn’t work anymore. My first summer sale 4 years ago made 7000 dollars from a single product. This year it has (so far) brought in just 800 dollars from 6 products, so something’s definitely not like it used to be.

New products seems to be the only thing that sells, and a lot less than they used too. I suspect that’s also why Spitfire, OT and VSL keep pumping out new stuff. They’d go bankrupt if they didn’t.

Whether the current state of affairs is because I’m a small dev with a limited number of (let’s be honest, niche and quirky) products, and I have reached and saturated my potential market, or it’s the economy (or a combination of both), I don’t yet know. Spitfires change in sales tactics and the fact that OT are now having regular sales, suggest to me that they are struggling too.

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I love the sound of your libraries! but yes the economy worldwide is in trouble.I am very close to getting a lib from you but in different times it would have been 2 or 3!
I don't mean to sound negative but we all need to look for alternative ways to sustain ourselves and families and get out of cities!! We live in an EXTREMELY deceitful world...

As much as it's mentioned quite a lot, I think the industry is going to have to change. AI is disrupting it slowly, and within 5 years I would be very surprised if most people buy instrument 'samples' any more.

You'll just provide a piece of music in some fashion, and ask the AI to provide the mockup. I don't say this lightly, but working in the tech industry and fully expecting my own as a software engineer to be lost in the next 5-10 years, I genuinely think the horse has bolted.

AI won't replace everything, but any rule-based/formulaic generation is under threat. It won't replace real orchestras any time soon, and I'm sure the capable professionals will be able to out-orchestrate AI for some time, but sounds for mockups and/or hobbyist/prosumer music will easily be replaced, and as such the price will plummet.

Am I a 'Doomer' ? Maybe, although I don't think it's AI that will be the problem - it will be the people that monetise it, and they are looking at replacing everything/everyone they can with a low-cost profit machine.

Perhaps some of the big Sample companies will move into AI-generation (If they're not already looking at it for sample-prep/QA, they're already out of the loop), but I don't see a sustainable market there.

That isn't to say that I don't see a market for small/unique sounds and 'human' curated specialities. As in any art/craft, I think they will still have potential - I just don't think there will be money/interest to fund 'yet another' string library, by the time most people can't tell the difference between that and something AI generated. The money will go back to real orchestras/players instead.