doctoremmet
Senior Member
If you buy a course from Ben Botkin, you get a discount code that actually stacks with whatever discount OT may offer.
Sample Talk Thread: OT Benjamin Wallfisch Strings
- Thread starter ALittleNightMusic
- Start date
Rudianos
Senior Member
well I paid for them ... BF this course was a steal. -40% Still have 1 more coupon for a future OT hyper bundle.
madfloyd
Senior Member
How is the course?
Last edited:
Rudianos
Senior Member
Here is a Legato of the BW Strings. And a record of all other comparable OT Teldex String Orchestra Libraries. Just a MIDI drag and drop situation. Default mics. Imagine implementing the Up and Down bows and rebalancing.
Tutti - Default Mix - Down Bow
View attachment OT - Benjamin Wallfisch - Legato.mp3
Divisi A - Down Bow
View attachment OT - Benjamin Wallfisch - Legato - Divisi A.mp3
Divisi B - Down Bow
View attachment OT - Benjamin Wallfisch - Legato - Divisi B.mp3
BS
View attachment 0. OT SINE Berlin Strings - Full.mp3
BS Konkakt
View attachment 0.2 OT Berlin Strings - Full.mp3
BSS Pre Update
View attachment 0.1 OT SINE Berlin Symphonic Strings - Full.mp3
BSS Post Update 2022
View attachment Multi - String Test Chamber - BSS SINE New Full.mp3
Tutti - Default Mix - Down Bow
View attachment OT - Benjamin Wallfisch - Legato.mp3
Divisi A - Down Bow
View attachment OT - Benjamin Wallfisch - Legato - Divisi A.mp3
Divisi B - Down Bow
View attachment OT - Benjamin Wallfisch - Legato - Divisi B.mp3
BS
View attachment 0. OT SINE Berlin Strings - Full.mp3
BS Konkakt
View attachment 0.2 OT Berlin Strings - Full.mp3
BSS Pre Update
View attachment 0.1 OT SINE Berlin Symphonic Strings - Full.mp3
BSS Post Update 2022
View attachment Multi - String Test Chamber - BSS SINE New Full.mp3
alexdepont
New Member
So biggest question....is this library worth it ? it has uniques features for it?
Rudianos
Senior Member
from what I have done so far - it is Top notch. Learning a lot.
Casiquire
Senior Member
Thank you for these insights. I appreciate your posts, and the things you say about Berlin Strings strongly echo my own feelings and the reasons why I think it's an invaluable workhorse.
One thing I wonder, couldn't we make a polymap to change bow direction via velocity?
clintowenellis
Member
Hey Ism, I live for pieces like this so I’m glad you shared it. Thanks! I’ll be learning this as soon as I get home - I really like your voicings and I’m always looking to up my piano skills. Thanks again
For reference:
Capybaras on the beach (the Ballet), mvt II:
View attachment Cappybaras on the Beach mvt 2.mp3
We start with some of the Transcendence SFX trems. These are used, I think, as something like fairly subtle accents. They're more than just regular trems, and you only get a hint of how they would evolve if held longer. They actually remind me of stratus a bit in how the note jumps by octaves, but they're much reigned in, so you only get a hint of it here. But I like the effect of the hint).
Then at 0:33 we have a touch of trills, the pedal note is held long enough for it to evolve, which interacts with the upper notes. It's nice effect, but before it can dominate the topos, it cuts out.
Then at 0:55 we hit the chords patch. It's a single note, and allowed to evolve. And again, it starts to create its own world, but cuts out before becoming too dominant.
And finally a ~1:57 the end with a hint of the longs, which has a kind of resolution ... but suggest more structure that's more felt that explicitly heard. Or at least, I think it gives suggestion of another world of its own, without slobbering that other world over the piano or the capybaras.
It's a silly little noddle, really. But the sound manages to be all quite subtle and gentle and gorgeous.
ka00
Patent Pending
Thanks for posting this. I think I prefer BSS. Sounds the most natural and pleasant to my taste.
I think I prefer BSS the most too out of all these. Interestingly I thought that BWS has arguably the worst legato. Not majorly so, but I think BSS certainly sounded smoother/less jarring during transitions.
ALittleNightMusic
Professional Amateur
Thanks for the comparisons! I preferred BS and BSS actually - the BWS tone here sounds...fuzzy, for the lack of a better term. And I don't find that it has superior legato to the other two libraries.
jbuhler
Senior Member
I’ve been playing a bit with the BWS viola divisi A, and a few observations: upbow and downbow legatos are subtly and usefully distinct. They don’t always sound like upbow and downbow, however, and oddly upbow often passes into silence better than downbow, which surprised me since there should be a natural diminuendo with the downbow. The upbow does have a gentler start, as expected. It’s still not clear to me how these are supposed to function since they don’t work especially well at capturing the effect of bowing. But the additional legato does give meaningful options for a passage.
The soft dynamic layers have a real intimacy to them. They sound quite lovely especially in divided parts. The higher dynamic layers are to me less distinctive in sound. It may make sense to turn off the top two or three dynamic layers in order to get better control of these lower dynamic layers.
Initial experiments with HZS suggests the libraries will get along well, though it will take some work with the mic set of each to make it all seamless.
The non-looped sustains still puzzle me as to the problem they are supposed to address. I have no objection to the sound. I just can’t yet convince myself there is a meaningful gain to the technique, even on long held chords. Maybe as I work with them more I’ll start to dial into the advantage of making sustains this way.
The soft dynamic layers have a real intimacy to them. They sound quite lovely especially in divided parts. The higher dynamic layers are to me less distinctive in sound. It may make sense to turn off the top two or three dynamic layers in order to get better control of these lower dynamic layers.
Initial experiments with HZS suggests the libraries will get along well, though it will take some work with the mic set of each to make it all seamless.
The non-looped sustains still puzzle me as to the problem they are supposed to address. I have no objection to the sound. I just can’t yet convince myself there is a meaningful gain to the technique, even on long held chords. Maybe as I work with them more I’ll start to dial into the advantage of making sustains this way.
lukevaljean
Active Member
What articulations do you plan to utilize with hzs?
jbuhler
Senior Member
Just the legatos and sustains for BWS viola divisi A, since that's all they have (and so far i only have violas divisi A). For HZS, any of the sustains (as well as the legatos) should work, depending on the context. So far I find the flautandos and tremolos sounding especially nice with the low dynamic layers of the viola divisi. Also I'm using viola upbows on the left (flipping the stereo field) and the downbows on the right, in the normal position. For HZS I'm using cellos left and right and the basses. That allows five part string writing: viola 1 and 2, cello 1 and 2, basses. (The cellos are obviously oversized in that arrangement. I'm not yet sure what i think about that.)
Rudianos
Senior Member
Just a BWS random into Goldwave - only Violin I. Figured not too many just put a simple solo out there for listen.
I really like the dynamic colors - the softs have that resiny sort of sound that is more clear captured than in BS, BSS.
View attachment BWS Violin I.mp3
Here is some ultra soft. Only PPP level active. SINE Rocks for selective dynamics.
BS
View attachment BS Soft.mp3
BSS
View attachment BSS Softs.mp3
BWS
View attachment BWS Soft.mp3
I really like the dynamic colors - the softs have that resiny sort of sound that is more clear captured than in BS, BSS.
View attachment BWS Violin I.mp3
Here is some ultra soft. Only PPP level active. SINE Rocks for selective dynamics.
BS
View attachment BS Soft.mp3
BSS
View attachment BSS Softs.mp3
BWS
View attachment BWS Soft.mp3
Last edited:
lukevaljean
Active Member
Oh right because legato is missing in the violas for HZS right?
jbuhler
Senior Member
Not for the HZS wide violas. That's actually my favorite legato of HZS.
But my thought was that I could use BWS as an HZS divisi, the main BWS section as a half section, the divisi as a quarter section. Then use upbow and downbow to create the complements. So in that sense, BWS becomes a means of reducing the immense weight of HZS, which you feel even with very low dynamics.
Here is a quick BWS noodle (ETA: just Viola Divisi A), all upbow sustains (i.e., no legato), stereo field reversed. This was all done on one track, so CC1 can't be used for anything other than general dynamic shaping. I also disabled the top two dynamic layers, but this sketch hardly gets into the second dynamic layer.
View attachment BWS-HZ Noodle 2 1.0.mp3
I may break this out and see how much it might improved with attention to bow direction and legato where appropriate.
And now the same midi for HZS wide violas, super flautando patch (I made no allowances for the fact that the instrument will respond differently to the midi):
View attachment BWS-HZ Noodle 2 1.0HZ.mp3
handz
Senior Member
Probably the most lifeless sample library I have ever heard, this is just not sounding good, BSS sounds way better.
Lee Blaske
Senior Member
Okay, I was questioning whether I needed another string library, but finally decided to buy it before the introductory price vanished. I spent a lot of time listening to the demos, especially the approximately 40 minute walkthrough. I listened to the walkthrough sounds vs. some of the libraries I own and really like. What I hear from BWS that really sells me on it is the five dynamic levels of sampling. I can really hear that. Soft really sounds like a softly played sound, and not just a sound played at a medium dynamic, but played back at a lower volume level. The ability to start very softly and swell to a huge, full volume is a dramatic effect, and this library seems like it can really do that better than a lot of others.
