Locking Sound to Picture? What's your method?

Thanks for your replies.

Jamie I agree with you completely. I'm usually a stickler for getting the right format. I usually use plain old VHS but I'm trying to go all computer these days.

My client isn't that computer saavy and the editor has left a long time ago. There is no music editor who I'd usually rely on for this kind of work and I'm trying to save the client grief by taking on more responsibility because she's paying rather well.

But, saying all that I'm definately going to do it your way next time.

Jose

I capture AVI through the Canopus DV110 and then play it back using the QuickTime option in Nuendo's video prefs.

T

A couple of years back I had some files delivered as quick time. But it's not something I do often; though I know things get delivered like this often. So I have some very basic questions of synch.
So how is time code preserved when say someone outputs something from AVID or Final Cut? Does it stay synch based on the codec used? What happens when someone delivers me a DVD or VHS and I want to rip QT's, how do I gaurantee my synch? I was just hinking that maybe there are a few frames that might get dropped or something.

Re Final Cut output, I have a client who sends me DV output from Final Cut Pro without timecode. So I spec'd, co-designed, and built a box that starts a frame-locked LTC timecode generator upon seeing the color bars in the preroll video signal, during a dub from DV to the workhorse UMatic. The cool part is that subsequent re-edits from the client (he's usually continuing to edit when I get preliminary music) can be reliably re-sync'd such that 01:00:00;00 remains the first frame of program video, so the hitpoints untouched by editorial changes remain in sync across versions. (Without the bright-video detector box, the TC start point would be random.)

-Peter

Peter,

ComposerDude said:

So I spec'd, co-designed, and built a box that starts a frame-locked LTC timecode generator upon seeing the color bars in the preroll video signal, during a dub from DV to the workhorse UMatic. The cool part is that subsequent re-edits from the client (he's usually continuing to edit when I get preliminary music) can be reliably re-sync'd such that 01:00:00;00 remains the first frame of program video, so the hitpoints untouched by editorial changes remain in sync across versions. (Without the bright-video detector box, the TC start point would be random.)

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hmmm seems pretty solid if you're getting that result. What is your box? Is it a peice of software or some hardware device?

The moment when i bit the bullet and invested into two decent VHS decks was the very moment when i stopped getting VHS tapes :roll:

Quicktime ever since.

Usually i drag it to the other computer and play it back there through a now old Miro DC30+ video card. Takes the strain off the main computer and gives me video playback on a TV screen. And the option to easily print VHS worktapes should i ever again be asked to supply them...

Playing video locked to MTC on another computer also makes it easy to divide the project into cues, as you just have to start a song at another TC address, as opposed to having the video start at bar -868.1.1 if it was on the music computer.

Christian

http://www.artofthegroove.com/logic/mp3/Christian_Obermaier_demo.mp3 (show reel) http://uk.geocities.com/christianobermaier/home.htm (home page) http://uk.geocities.com/christianobermaier/Studio.htm (studio pics) http://uk.geocities.com/christianobermaier/Gearlist.htm (gear list)

jonathanparham said:

Peter,

ComposerDude said:

So I spec'd, co-designed, and built a box that starts a frame-locked LTC timecode generator upon seeing the color bars in the preroll video signal, during a dub from DV to the workhorse UMatic. The cool part is that subsequent re-edits from the client (he's usually continuing to edit when I get preliminary music) can be reliably re-sync'd such that 01:00:00;00 remains the first frame of program video, so the hitpoints untouched by editorial changes remain in sync across versions. (Without the bright-video detector box, the TC start point would be random.)

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hmmm seems pretty solid if you're getting that result. What is your box? Is it a peice of software or some hardware device?

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[edit - a mercifully shorter version of the tweaky details]:
Hardware, tweaked so we can start locally-striped timecode consistently and reliably during my dub to the playback video deck.

Peter,
Thanks for the in depth explanation. But I when you say issues vanish with quick time, I guess that's my question. Couldn't something be off by a frame or two if you computer is doing a lot of processing?

Peter,
Thanks for the explanation. Quick time is becoming so common now, especially as project studios get more desktop video editing.

I guess the best you can do with Quick time is:check the codec, ask for timecode 'burn in,' request 2 pop, and bars.

I've been getting stuff for the project I'm on as a DVD.

Tried loads of rippers with varying success - dvd2avi, Fairuse wizard etc

Now I rip using DVD Decrypter (freeware) to an mpg 2 file (it rips to a .mp2 file) and seperate ac3 stream for the audio. I rename the .mp2 to an .mpg, de-compress the ac3 to a stereo wav using a freeware program BESWEET and that's it. Means I get a perfect DVD quality picture full screen, with seperate audio.

Word of warning to people using Nuendo or SX - keep your mpg as seperate picture with no audio and have the audio as a seperate wav before you import it into your project - so that nuendo's video player can just focus on playing the picture instead of having to distinguish between 2 seperate streams in the mpg. Even though when you import an mpg/avi it extracts the audio to your folder, it still has to work harder seperating the 2 streams.

Ian

Simon Ravn said:

As everybody else probably, I sometimes receive files on CD, sometimes VHS. I then render that to 720x576 PAL DIVX format and use a separate PC running Cubase for nothing but video sync, sync and temp track. This works flawlessly and is very responsive.

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Simon, are you still do it this way? Do you send sync out of one computer using midi time code into another or do you have them networked?

Jose

ned .. i know you're on logic .. can you tell me whether you start a new "song" for each .mov you use in the project or just keep using the same one and lock the various scenes..

i've been using separate songs for each scene of a film i'm working on.. but a couple of days ago i decided i wanted to adapt one cue for something else too..

so i lined up both scenes and wrote away. no bother..

i eventually bounced a couple of stereo stereo files so theyt could get sent off for evaluation.. thank god i opened a new song and imported the new stereo files to check them against picture.. because the second one was all out of sync...(the 1st one was fine) had to scrap the second file in the song and start over again on a clean song.. there were then no syncing issues..

WTF>>> is this a logic foible ? or do we really have to start a new song for each scene to be sure of it matching..

Usually directors give me a DVD so I use Super DVD Ripper and recompress to Microsoft MPEG 4 in AVI format. The size I use is 320x240 and when I need to see the full screen I do it in Cubase just with a click. It works for me

fitch said:

ned .. i know you're on logic

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Hi Claire,

I haven't used QTime for a film/tv thing in ages! But when I did, yeah, I only used 1 movie per song. Typically, 1 mov would equal 1 reel of film. Same thing for an ad or an opening/closing tv theme. If you're getting a bunch of short movies, and you find it a drag to have so many songs, just ask the editor to make you longer combined versions.

With quicktime I have this problem: When I put the cursor for example in 1'23", the screen does not goes to that point if the sequencer is in stop. When I click play from that point, the movie starts to run quickly until it reaches to the exact point. I don't know if I have explained correctly :roll:
So I prefer to use AVI.

The sequencer I use is Cubase SX3. Does somebody has the same problem?

Most of my film arrives as either a QuickTime movie or on VHS. If it's on VHS I encode it using an ADVC-100 box and Final Cut Express. The files are then played as QuickTime movies in Logic Audio on a seperate screen.

I've found that I can't use a TV screen for the picture since it is always about 12 frames out compared to the movie on the computer screen, which is absolutely useless for spot effects. Would a seperate computer solve this problem - a Mac Mini for example? I'm quite happy working to the computer movie but it's a bit intimate when I have clients around and we are all crowded around the same screen!

Commander said:

I'm quite happy working to the computer movie but it's a bit intimate when I have clients around and we are all crowded around the same screen!

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oooh yea baby!

Ed said:

oooh yea baby!

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Well, it depends who they are of course!