CSS vs BBCSO Core

Are you referring to the full Cinematic Studio Series or only Cinematic Studio Strings? The full series is quite a bit more expensive than BBCSO Core.

They’re both great libraries in their own right. BBCSO is insane value considering you get the full orchestra for the same price as the strings from CSS. Many people, myself included, love it and praise it highly.

Cinematic Studio Series and especially the strings is also great value in its own right, considering the quality you get for the price when compared to other libraries like SSO and Berlin. Still much more expensive than BBCSO Core though.

In terms of sound BBCSO is a larger ensemble and a larger sound. Though in ordinary spitfire manner it shines at the lower dynamics and never goes as loud as the competition.

CSS is a smaller ensemble and a more focused sound. It plays louder if you want to and many here would swear by it as their desert island choice for strings and legatos.

In the end they’re both great. Listen to demos and go with your gut. Or go with what you can afford. The full CSS series (still missing percussion) is more comparable to BBCSO pro in terms of prize. So comparing to Core I guess you would only be buying the strings.

In that case, if ~400 is what you’re gonna spend, it’s a choice between one of the best string libraries and one of the best all-in-one full orchestras. Only you know what you need and which sound you like best.

Go with your gut. Find what sound you like and go with that. They are both fantastic libraries. But, with BBCSO you get the full orchestra.

José Herring said:

Go with your gut. Find what sound you like and go with that. They are both fantastic libraries. But, with BBCSO you get the full orchestra.

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I was listening to some of your stuff on another thread just now, wow! What would be your take on BBCSO Pro vs. Cinematic Studio Series? I think I can swing either of those, but not sure I'd need all the extra mics that I'd get with BBCSO Pro

Here's the deal: my family has allotted me $2400 to do with what I want. I was thinking of sinking it all into libraries, but I need advice on how to spend that effectively. I've been scouring various forums for input.

After reviewing a bunch of stuff, my options look like the following:

Package 1
------------
BBCSO Core
Komplete 13 CE *upgrade from Komplete 12*
Damage 2
Albion I
Strezov Choir Essentials
Omnisphere

or

Package 2
-----------
CSS
CSS Solo Strings
CSB
CSWW
Damage 2
Strezov Choir Essentials
U-He Zebra2 *possibly Zebra Dark*

I already have Cubase Pro 11. My keyboard is a Yamaha Motif XF6, and I have a Maschine Mk3, so I'm good on hardware.

This is my dilemma. I hope someone can help. That $2400 is a hard wall, so I'd need to hope for a sale on some of the options.

Weyenberg Creative said:

I was listening to some of your stuff on another thread just now, wow! What would be your take on BBCSO Pro vs. Cinematic Studio Series? I think I can swing either of those, but not sure I'd need all the extra mics that I'd get with BBCSO Pro

Click to expand...

I have my music somewhere here? I usually try and avoid that

I love them both. I love Alex and I love the guys at Spitfire.

My personal take. I don't own any CSS. I wish I did. For some reason though the section size of the strings and the smaller brass room just haven't quite hit the mark. The timber of the strings isn't really for me but I will at some point get the brass and woodwinds though. I judge this just from the demos not from user experience. But, many, many people I respect love CSS so you can't discount it. I'm weird. I don't hear music right. I certainly don't hear what others hear. I've learned to live with my shortcomings and play to my strengths which lead me to BBCSO.

I bought BBCSO core just to try it out. I love it and as soon as finances allow I will probably upgrade to pro. I grew up listening to concert orchestras rather than 80's and 90's film scores and BBCSO has that definitive concert hall classical sound. Some people think that it lacks loudness. Nah, if anything it lacks softness imo. But, if you grew up listening to 90's Media Venture scores then it won't be loud enough for you if that's the sound you're after.

That being said, BBCSO isn't for everybody. You really do need to know a bit about orchestration to get good results. I think CSS is a bit more forgiving in that regard.

Truth be told if you're starting out I wouldn't just bank it all on just one library. Each library has its strengths and weaknesses. If you could swing it, I'd give BBCSO core+ at least CSStrings and CSB. That would be a killer combo. Then when money permits get BBCSO Pro and the rest of CSS.

Be warned though BBCSO is a very wet library so you'll need a good reverb to match your CSS libraries to it.

José Herring said:

I have my music somewhere here? I usually try and avoid that

I love them both. I love Alex and I love the guys at Spitfire.

My personal take. I don't own any CSS. I wish I did. For some reason though the section size of the strings and the smaller brass room just haven't quite hit the mark. The timber of the strings isn't really for me but I will at some point get the brass and woodwinds though. I judge this just from the demos not from user experience. But, many, many people I respect love CSS so you can't discount it. I'm weird. I don't hear music right. I certainly don't hear what others hear. I've learned to live with my shortcomings and play to my strengths which lead me to BBCSO.

I bought BBCSO core just to try it out. I love it and as soon as finances allow I will probably upgrade to pro. I grew up listening to concert orchestras rather than 80's and 90's film scores and BBCSO has that definitive concert hall classical sound. Some people think that it lacks loudness. Nah, if anything it lacks softness imo. But, if you grew up listening to 90's Media Venture scores then it won't be loud enough for you if that's the sound you're after.

That being said, BBCSO isn't for everybody. You really do need to know a bit about orchestration to get good results. I think CSS is a bit more forgiving in that regard.

Truth be told if you're starting out I wouldn't just bank it all on just one library. Each library has its strengths and weaknesses. If you could swing it, I'd give BBCSO core+ at least CSStrings and CSB. That would be a killer combo. Then when money permits get BBCSO Pro and the rest of CSS.

Be warned though BBCSO is a very wet library so you'll need a good reverb to match your CSS libraries to it.

Click to expand...

oops maybe it was another Jose

Look at post #5, that's the dilemma. Based on what you said, maybe option 2 would be better, and wait on a sale for BBCSO Pro.

Weyenberg Creative said:

Here's the deal: my family has allotted me $2400 to do with what I want. I was thinking of sinking it all into libraries, but I need advice on how to spend that effectively. I've been scouring various forums for input.

After reviewing a bunch of stuff, my options look like the following:

Package 1
------------
BBCSO Core
Komplete 13 CE *upgrade from Komplete 12*
Damage 2
Albion I
Strezov Choir Essentials
Omnisphere

or

Package 2
-----------
CSS
CSS Solo Strings
CSB
CSWW
Damage 2
Strezov Choir Essentials
U-He Zebra2 *possibly Zebra Dark*

I already have Cubase Pro 11. My keyboard is a Yamaha Motif XF6, and I have a Maschine Mk3, so I'm good on hardware.

This is my dilemma. I hope someone can help. That $2400 is a hard wall, so I'd need to hope for a sale on some of the options.

Click to expand...

BBCSO woodwinds are top notch. If you can just add CSB and CSS to package one and drop Albion I and Omnisphere. Komplete has some great synths in it so you may not need Zebra. Massive X, Monark and others can cover Zebra well. Though Zebra is a great synth.

José Herring said:

BBCSO woodwinds are top notch. If you can just add CSB and CSS to package one and drop Albion I and Omnisphere. Komplete has some great synths in it so you may not need Zebra. Massive X, Monark and others can cover Zebra well. Though Zebra is a great synth.

Click to expand...

Thank you for the excellent feedback!

Weyenberg Creative said:

Thank you for the excellent feedback!

Click to expand...

No problem. But, I can't over emphasize enough of trusting your own ears and your own gut. You have your own sound and you need to find the products that will allow you to get that out.

Absolutely. I've got a bit of ear fatigue atm from listening attentively to so many comparison videos that I'm basically fried. I'll probably add more libraries slowly, but I didn't want to make any "rookie mistakes"

Weyenberg Creative said:

Here's the deal: my family has allotted me $2400 to do with what I want. I was thinking of sinking it all into libraries, but I need advice on how to spend that effectively. I've been scouring various forums for input.

After reviewing a bunch of stuff, my options look like the following:

Package 1
------------
BBCSO Core
Komplete 13 CE *upgrade from Komplete 12*
Damage 2
Albion I
Strezov Choir Essentials
Omnisphere

or

Package 2
-----------
CSS
CSS Solo Strings
CSB
CSWW
Damage 2
Strezov Choir Essentials
U-He Zebra2 *possibly Zebra Dark*

I already have Cubase Pro 11. My keyboard is a Yamaha Motif XF6, and I have a Maschine Mk3, so I'm good on hardware.

This is my dilemma. I hope someone can help. That $2400 is a hard wall, so I'd need to hope for a sale on some of the options.

Click to expand...

Both packages are a great choice. I love Albion One and it layers pretty well with BBCSO and Komplete 13 Ultimate CE gives you so much great sounds (Cremona Quartet, Synth, cinematic instruments and sooo many expansions for you Maschine Mikro). Together with Omnisphere this looks like the perfect cinematic scoring bundle that also can do classic orchestral music.
Your second package is focused mainly on Orchestra sounds and includes the best of the best (for many people) with the Cinematic Studio Series.
In the end it depends on what music you want to create with it.... but I think package 1 offers more flexibility.

I am in a similar situation. Budgeted cash for studio hardware & libraries. Being music producer moving to scoring.

I would go with the following Package:

BBCSO Core
Abbey Road One
Damage 2
ZebraHZ
EW Hollywood Choirs

My reasoning is:

BBCSO as my main workhorse.
ARO as my sketching library, sound much better to me than Albion One.
ZebraHZ - You can't beat the flexibility of this one. Easy to come up with crazy sounds.

Keep Komplete 12, don't upgrade. Nothing exciting for me in there.

Finally, might worth considering getting each of those in a Sale to get the most for your money. You will need time to familiarize yourself with each of those. So get one, learn it, once something in a sale get it, learn etc.

I am following the above. Grabbed ARO last month, some EW stuff, and waiting for the next batch.

Since both packages have the same choices for percussion and choir (Damage and Strezov), and I'm not really into synth sounds myself (though both Omnisphere and Zebra are probably great choices), I'll only comment on the differences in orchestral choices between the two packs.

If you go the CSS route, you probably can't go wrong with their full set. Most people absolutely love them, and if you like what you hear (the smaller sections and more dramatic sound), they seem like a good choice that will also set you free from the paradox of choice which the other pack might create for you. Here you'll only have one orchestra, and you'll just have to use that one.

If you go the other route (maybe because you want larges sections or a more classic sound), I'd probably skip Albion and either replace that with Abbey Road ONE if the ensembles is what you're after, or just get BBC Pro instead. After that I'd probably skip Komplete 13 too, and instead scout for stray sounds from LABS, and PianoBook when you need them. And either save the money or just add CSS to the pack.

Spitfire will likely have a sale in May and you’ll be able to get BBCSO at 40% off. Heavyocity has regular sales as well and you should be able to pick up Damage 2 at 25% off. Did you figure in the loyalty discounts you’ll get from Alex after you buy the first library there? I can’t remember when NI has their upgrade sales (if new ownership continues them). Wait for it and I agree with the comment that you can likely spend that money better elsewhere.

I also agree with the advice to go with Abbey Road One over Albion I. ARO will likely be on sale for 25% off during the May sale.

Leave budget for SSDs. How much RAM do you have on your computer? It‘s not enough! (That’s a joke. But it’s hard to have too much RAM.)

BBCSO Core has a great sound (not comparable to Discover; totally different set of samples).
Things that I note now that I own it:
The library is very wet; it will always sound like it's in a hall even if there's no "reverb"
There are only 3 dynamic regions and the transitions can be quite sudden if your CC ramp is too steep.
The brass loud dynamics aren't loud. The brass solo instruments don't have a really well-defined character. Still a great warm brass section (this section is great in the lower dynamics).
You have to load every individual instrument/instrument section by hand if you don't have a preset template. This means very intense detail-oriented orchestration.
You have to remove unused articulations to save your RAM.
You cannot load multi-instrument patches/tracks using the plugin (probably means it's eating up a small amount of extra RAM).
Divisi strings and split WWs and Brass are hard to replicate accurately.

In my experience, my string ensembles can range from 2 to 6 gigs of RAM depending on how many articulations and "divisi" passages there are.
BBCSO also blends super well with the Spitfire Solo Strings library. I love the sound of the 1st desk Violin, and I normally just copy+drag the exact same midi data. It blends and adds that extra lead player sound.

I personally want to pair BBCSO with Albion One and then get either Cinematic Studio Strings or Spitfire Studio Strings Professional.
Abbey Road One is like the paid BBC Discover plugin. Amazing quality of sound for every section; ensemble patches, mic mixing, but no legatos. I personally will not be getting Abbey Road One because of the lack of legatos in the ensemble patches. Not to mention, SA's latest update to Abbey Road One is not free or an update.

Does Cinematic Studio Strings ever come up in a sale?

packhorse said:

Does Cinematic Studio Strings ever come up in a sale?

Click to expand...

As far as I have heard only Black Friday and it's always 30% if not mistaken

I strongly recommend going to CSS/CSB/CSW route. Here is why:

- Consistent articulations meaning you can copy-paste parts between instruments and (to a degree) between sections.
- Best-in-class legato (including re-bow/re-tongue legato which BBCSO doesn't have afaik).
- Covers the bread and butter articulations. Spitfire have really nice esoteric articulations, but you're much less likely to use all their extended technique patches unless your style of writing is more pad-like.
- Great support. There's a non-zero chance you might get some kind of discount if you send Alex a polite e-mail and ask for it, since you aim to get CSS/W/B at once.
- Close/Main/Room/Mix mics are all you really need to shape your sound. Don't be fooled by anyone who says otherwise. Helps keep install size down too.

The only downside I find to the Cinematic Studio series are these:

- CSS has a relatively dark sound and control over vibrato is limited.
- CSW is a slightly mixed bag. Oboe, flute and piccolo are great, Clarinet's legato needs works. Overall the dynamic transitions are a bit less smooth than you might like.
- I find in some situations that the shortest notes on the brass aren't quite short enough, or that the attacks are (in the trumpets mainly) not quite sharp enough.
- Due to built-in delays the instruments are difficult to play in live.

An update is in the work however that will add a runs mode for the strings. Not much else is known at the moment but I think there may be some more fixes (hopefully a tighter legato for some of the winds) coming in that update.

I've got a bunch of demos for the cinematic studio series on my soundcloud which you can check out. The only exceptions are the percussion (Abbey Road One and Hollywood Percussion) and harp (ProjectSAM Harp) because those products haven't been made yet by Alex and his team.